tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8256060.post1396427587737309450..comments2024-03-17T10:11:46.952-04:00Comments on Film Experience Blog: Musical of the Month: Velvet GoldmineNATHANIEL Rhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/11597109147678235399noreply@blogger.comBlogger35125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8256060.post-5218138588362003542009-03-21T21:42:00.000-04:002009-03-21T21:42:00.000-04:00I am not overly fond of the music of either Bob Dy...I am not overly fond of the music of either Bob Dylan or David Bowie, and yet "Velvet Goldmine" and "I'm Not There" are two of my favorite films.<BR/><BR/>Both of Haynes' post-"Superstar" biopics reveal much more about their subjects than would be possible in a context that necessitated factual accuracy. He gets to the root of glam rock with composite characters that represent all of the rock stars who cultivated androgynous, bisexual, or homosexual images and then abandoned them the second that 70's sexual permissiveness petered out and AIDS hit- David Bowie, Lou Reed, Iggy Pop, Mick Jagger. This is what I love about "Velvet Goldmine"- that it is not so much a celebration of the career of David Bowie, but an extremely sad film that mourns the betrayal of 70's queer youths by their heroes. The lack of David Bowie's cooperation greatly improves the film- the soundtrack that was created as a replacement is better than Bowie's material, and the Bowie character is cast in a defiantly negative light.<BR/><BR/>The reason that I find "I'm Not There" slightly less compelling is that it focuses on one specific figure rather than an entire trend or era of music. My favorite scenes, still, are the interview segments with Julianne Moore-as-Joan Baez, shooing cats out of her chair and wearing lots of turquoise jewelry. The two times I saw "I'm Not There" in the theater, my friends and I laughed hysterically at these parts that were CLEARLY INTENDED TO BE FUNNY because EVERYONE KNOWS JOAN BAEZ SUCKS and the movie BRIEFLY BECOMES "A MIGHTY WIND" WITH THOSE GREAT STILLS OF JULIANNE IN A HIPPIE WIG and we received disturbed and nervous looks from the rest of the audience, who had deduced that since they were seeing an "art film" that was not marketed as a comedy they could not laugh at anything in it. When the DVD came out months later I was vindicated; Haynes said that he had to leave the room when Julianne Moore was filming the aforementioned scenes because he was laughing so hard. Take that, stuffy Alamo Drafthouse patrons!<BR/><BR/>I agree with those who have said that "I'm Not There" was easier for critics to embrace both because it did not feature the kind of confrontational, explicit queerness of "Velvet Goldmine" and because of its having a subject as worshiped as Bob Dylan. The queerness of "Velvet Goldmine" is astonishing to this day and frankly I have no idea how it sort of slipped under the radar; that movie is GAY. It's more shocking now that Ewan McGregor and Christian Bale have become huge stars- to see them having beautiful, romantic anal sex while Oscar Wilde's UFO sprinkles glitter on them. Male bisexuality is also rarely, if ever, presented as anything other than a joke in film and "Velvet Goldmine" has equally hot scenes of heterosexual and homosexual couplings. I just can see very easily how American critics would just not know where to put this. Its critical reputation has gotten much bigger over the years, as has its following- "Velvet Goldmine" is extremely popular with young girls because they get to see their favorite male movie stars make out with each other in awesome outfits. <BR/><BR/>That said, "Safe" is without a doubt Haynes' best film and is possibly the greatest film ever made by anyone ever. :)Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8256060.post-80648572395520847792008-11-14T23:49:00.000-05:002008-11-14T23:49:00.000-05:00I just don't like the prosiac definition of queer ...I just don't like the prosiac definition of queer (which is what Velvet Goldmine espouses, or more accurately, what david s probably means when he says "unapologetically queer"). Especially when it's used as a way to dismiss the critical response to one of my recent faves (I'm still behind on Haynes, but I think I'm Not There is his best).Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8256060.post-91194147400508257322008-11-14T09:43:00.000-05:002008-11-14T09:43:00.000-05:00yeah, i'd say Brokeback isn't "queer" in the polit...yeah, i'd say Brokeback isn't "queer" in the political and definitely not in the aesthetic sense. It's so traditional aesthetically... so maybe it is queer politically for that subversion. Hmmmm.<BR/><BR/>good questionNATHANIEL Rhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11597109147678235399noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8256060.post-27168377478400736032008-11-14T03:39:00.000-05:002008-11-14T03:39:00.000-05:00Girls Aloud (and thus Cheryl Cole/Tweedy) are God....Girls Aloud (and thus Cheryl Cole/Tweedy) are God.<BR/><BR/>Arkaan, I'd say the difference between a queer film such as <I>Velvet Goldmine</I> and a queer film such as <I>Brokeback Mountain</I> is that the former is out to throw it in everyone's face and show the more flamboyant side of it.Glennhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08194113062830373898noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8256060.post-67297279918443454912008-11-13T21:38:00.000-05:002008-11-13T21:38:00.000-05:00Is Brokeback Mountain queer? Are we using the aca...Is Brokeback Mountain queer? Are we using the academic definition or the prosaic definition?Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8256060.post-4659079656839869372008-11-13T18:50:00.000-05:002008-11-13T18:50:00.000-05:00I feel like the reviews were stronger because it's...I feel like the reviews were stronger because it's a more masculine film on the whole. It's not as gay. I can't even think of an unapologetically queer film that got astounding reviews on the level of I'm Not There.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8256060.post-64433389034610947562008-11-13T14:24:00.000-05:002008-11-13T14:24:00.000-05:00FYI, Janice:Cheryl Cole (nee Tweedy) is the most f...FYI, Janice:<BR/><BR/>Cheryl Cole (nee Tweedy) is the most famous member of Girls Aloud, a terrific British girl group who have cornered the market in joyfully eccentric pop. Think The Supremes meets Franz Ferdinand, and you're about halfway there.<BR/><BR/>Cole, meanwhile, is a constant UK tabloid presence following her marriage to footballer Ashley Cole and her appointment this year as a judge on The X Factor -- the UK version of American Idol.<BR/><BR/>Check out "Biology," the Aloud's finest moment to date: <BR/><BR/>http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=1jRhiuFKmdc<BR/><BR/>Whew, I could have just linked you to a Wikipedia article, but that wouldn'ty have been nearly as geeky :)Guy Lodgehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06073912302467109996noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8256060.post-36414451473656215622008-11-13T13:07:00.000-05:002008-11-13T13:07:00.000-05:00cheryl tweedy janice i think it's a British thing....<A HREF="http://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=cheryl+tweedy&search_type=" REL="nofollow">cheryl tweedy</A> janice i think it's a British thing. i didn't really know either.NATHANIEL Rhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11597109147678235399noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8256060.post-24561403934654295262008-11-13T12:27:00.000-05:002008-11-13T12:27:00.000-05:00I agree with what you have to say. I haven't seen ...I agree with what you have to say. I haven't seen "I'm not there", i would like to, but "Velvet goldmine" to me is brilliant. It's a perfect film not only capturing an era but showcasing various lifestyles. It's beautiful and magical. One of my favorite movies. I will see "I'm not there" because I have heard it's a great film. I don't care for Dylan's voice but I love his songwriting.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8256060.post-49052345040129836982008-11-13T11:03:00.000-05:002008-11-13T11:03:00.000-05:00And can I just throw this out there:WHO is Cheryl ...And can I just throw this out there:<BR/><BR/>WHO is Cheryl Tweedy?<BR/><BR/>Off-topic I finally saw "Superstar" online and...wow. To read about, the use of dolls sounds like a joke - I wouldn't have believed it could be so moving. I'm just glad his career didn't get buried along with the film.Janicehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08049113750769117163noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8256060.post-63987317346986536302008-11-12T19:42:00.000-05:002008-11-12T19:42:00.000-05:00Can I just throw this out there:TODD HAYNES MUST M...Can I just throw this out there:<BR/><BR/>TODD HAYNES MUST MAKE A MOVIE ABOUT CHERYL TWEEDY!<BR/><BR/>It would be the single greatest movie-going experience of all time, no doubt.Glenn Dunkshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05424659636310160482noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8256060.post-12214228544408697982008-11-12T15:10:00.000-05:002008-11-12T15:10:00.000-05:00Billy D ---ooh, that's a great idea. Any takers?Be...Billy D ---ooh, that's a great idea. Any takers?<BR/><BR/>Bemis --fashionably late!NATHANIEL Rhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11597109147678235399noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8256060.post-43222108082912800652008-11-12T14:53:00.000-05:002008-11-12T14:53:00.000-05:00Here's my (belated, sorry) contribution: http://ci...Here's my (belated, sorry) contribution: <BR/><BR/>http://cinevistaramascope.blogspot.com/2008/11/curves-of-your-lips-rewrite-history.html<BR/><BR/>I love I'm Not There, but I can't disagree - Velvet Goldmine is better.Andrew Bemishttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06097037829531087694noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8256060.post-70289053698262524782008-11-12T13:52:00.000-05:002008-11-12T13:52:00.000-05:00Can someone do a shot-by-shot breakdown of "The Tr...Can someone do a shot-by-shot breakdown of "The Trolley Song?" As the single greatest musical interlude in cinematic history (I defy you...) it deserves it. And I'm too lazy to do it. <BR/><BR/>xoxo Thanks!Billy Dhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15773336429810369206noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8256060.post-87064973748238301562008-11-12T07:22:00.000-05:002008-11-12T07:22:00.000-05:00you are all so crazy. Cheryl Tweedy? But it's funn...you are all so crazy. Cheryl Tweedy? But it's funny to hear <I>Superstar</I> mentioned as the top of Haynes' rock pictures if only because while typing this up I totally forgot about it. Even though I love it thiiiiiiiiiiis much and including it brings me to the forgotten realization that 1/2 of his filmography is pop/rock/music based.<BR/><BR/>I still think <I>[safe]</I> and <I>Far From Heaven</I> are Haynes' best films but the early stuff <I>Dottie Gets Spanked, Poison, Superstar</I> is wonderfully imagined and personal. I agree with James that one of the drawbacks of <I>I'm Not There</I> is that disconnected feel. I imagine it's more personal than it comes off but I do actually think it's the least of Haynes's 6 features.<BR/><BR/>Not that it's not good.NATHANIEL Rhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11597109147678235399noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8256060.post-39671653240204899642008-11-12T06:49:00.000-05:002008-11-12T06:49:00.000-05:00A Todd Haynes biopic of Cheryl Tweedy (I'm glad we...A Todd Haynes biopic of Cheryl Tweedy (I'm glad we're using her maiden name, btw) is something I would pay very good money to see. Can you imagine her and the Aloud in some outrageous Sandy Powell threads? Too awesome.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8256060.post-92002142344517501212008-11-12T05:12:00.000-05:002008-11-12T05:12:00.000-05:00Absolutely love Velvet Goldmine. It has the most g...Absolutely love Velvet Goldmine. It has the most glam a film could have. Plus it has Ewan McGregor jumping up and down...naked. Really, what else does a film need?;)<BR/>On the other hand I thought I'm Not There was incredibly boring. The acting was great (on most parts) and of course the soundtrack is great.<BR/>But Velvet is iconic, I wouldn't even put the two films on the same level.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8256060.post-62147748041844452392008-11-12T03:20:00.000-05:002008-11-12T03:20:00.000-05:00Full disclosure amid Glenn's provocative comment.....Full disclosure amid Glenn's provocative comment... I do love Bob Dylan's music (i.e. voice, mood, attitude...EVERYTHING) but love the film for totally different reasons that have very little to do with the music or even the Dylan persona(s) for that matter. <BR/><BR/>I agree that some small spattering critics loved it because they love Dylan and want to affirm his status; evenso, its shorthanded to think that they would quickly ignore films about "lesser" figures just because they aren't Gods of Rock or whatever. Even Nathaniel's piece goes to show that people aren't so in need of affirmation to ignore great filmmaking when its great filmmaking. If Haynes made a movie about Cheryl Tweedy, it could easily be as well received. <BR/><BR/>Wow...is it really 3:30 AM? Why the hell am I not there? (zing!...in bed, that is!) That's the lamest thing I have ever typed. I apologize to everyone who read it...James Hansenhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09650436008918093617noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8256060.post-64382804213870877742008-11-12T03:07:00.000-05:002008-11-12T03:07:00.000-05:00Admittedly, I have only seen VG once and it was qu...Admittedly, I have only seen VG once and it was quite a long while ago. That said, I am nuts about IM NOT THERE. What can I say? I like structuralist/dialectical epics that present multiple theses about single characters (hmm...sounds like I think CHE is this year's IM NOT THERE...except in a totally different way...) What it does lack, however, is the same authenticity found in Haynes' earlier films. Although it is bright, crisp, bold, and beautiful (whoa, adjectives!), it feels a little more disconnected than VG, POISON, or SAFE (his best film, cough cough.) <BR/><BR/>So...yeah...I side with IM NOT THERE at the moment, but can certainly see why people like VG more and will gladly change my mind if/when I have VG fresher in my mind.James Hansenhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09650436008918093617noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8256060.post-35770348547414853652008-11-12T02:59:00.000-05:002008-11-12T02:59:00.000-05:00I think the role in Velvet Goldmine is the only ro...I think the role in <I>Velvet Goldmine</I> is the only role JRM should have ever taken. It's clearly the perfect role for him and he's ace in it, but everything else from him is quite terrible (I can stand him in <I>Match Point</I> if for no other reason than the movie itself is just so good).<BR/><BR/>He was recently in a movie called <I>Children of the Silk Road</I> (or <I>Children of Huang Shi</I>) and there's an early scene he shares with David Wenham, which just shows how incredibly miscast Meyers was and how Wenham being cast in the lead role would have substantially improved the film.<BR/><BR/>But back to <I>Velvet Goldmine</I>. I do like it more than <I>I'm Not There</I>, but I think the two are Haynes' weakest efforts (and by "weakest" I mean, they're better than anything most directors will ever come up with, but they're not the all-out masterpieces that <I>[safe]</I> and <I>Far From Heaven</I>) are. In fact, I think Haynes' best biopic work is <I>Superstar</I>. It helps that I prefer the music in that one to both glam rock and whatever the hell it is Bob Dylan cranks out and gets outlandish praise for. <BR/><BR/>That was one thing, I think, that lead to <I>I'm Not There</I>'s critical reception. If it were an equally esoteric and insider look at, say, Cheryl Tweedy the critics wouldn't have blinked twice about it, but because it's Bob Dylan - and hence, respectable - then they went feverish about it (or, some did anyway). I know not all critics were like that, but I am positive a small smattering of them were. That and <I>I'm Not There</I> is so overtly queer and we all know major film critics' (just like the Academy, actually) steer away from things that embrace queerness with a locked fist.<BR/><BR/>Unless, of course, we're talking about the costume design category. I still love that Sandy Powell got an Oscar nod for this, don't you? That costume branch really knows how to throw a curve ball or two.Glennhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08194113062830373898noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8256060.post-11434707988195326362008-11-12T00:13:00.000-05:002008-11-12T00:13:00.000-05:00Any points removed from I'm Not There for not havi...Any points removed from I'm Not There for not having Toni Collete should be added back because I'm not There does have Julianne Moore!Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8256060.post-87480500320731649872008-11-11T23:36:00.000-05:002008-11-11T23:36:00.000-05:00Wow, I really should've been able to pick that up....Wow, I really should've been able to pick that up. I blame it on my kneejerk reaction.<BR/><BR/>I totally love Danny Huston.Joshuahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02455492676909216509noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8256060.post-77421046355263409102008-11-11T23:33:00.000-05:002008-11-11T23:33:00.000-05:00joshua as dave said it's the inverse. if Danny Hus...<B>joshua</B> as dave said it's the inverse. if Danny Huston appears you have to subtract points ;)NATHANIEL Rhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11597109147678235399noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8256060.post-63522555580800604722008-11-11T22:14:00.000-05:002008-11-11T22:14:00.000-05:00I have to go with Goldmine, and I think the Toni C...I have to go with Goldmine, and I think the Toni Collete thing is the strongest arguement.Chris Na Tarajahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06545312034833563234noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8256060.post-65534195063120131332008-11-11T22:02:00.000-05:002008-11-11T22:02:00.000-05:00What's the Danny Huston rule?What's the Danny Huston rule?Joshuahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02455492676909216509noreply@blogger.com