Saturday, February 25, 2006


Some not-so-happy readers give feedback on my comments about the Academy's Music Branch @ the Oscar Countdown.


adam k. said...

I think almost every one of Williams' wins is justified (and his not winning for Empire was ridiculous), but 45 is A LOT of nominations. I don't get how one can complain that he's lost too many times.

I mean, has anyone complained about Meryl Streep, the acting equivalent of John Williams in her peers' eyes, losing 11 times? And 9 times in a row, at that? No, because she has been nommed more than any actor in history.

Thinking about 40 losses instead of 45 nominations and 5 wins is just a good old-fashioned "glass is half empty" attitude.

OhMyTrill said...

He is VERY overnominated...and this is coming from a music student (whatever that means)...he has basically won every time he deserved to, and I will agree that he should have won for Empire...I guess the academy prefers Tradition over inovation, since every Johns Williams score resembles every other (they are just slightly changed to match whatever ethnic feel or mood they need to be). He is a very good film composer, but people really need to get over him...really fast. I used to love him...but the same thing gets old after a while. I agree with you Nathaniel...can't we celebrate somebody else?

John T said...

I happen to be of the opinion that a good chunk of Williams's nominations are deserved, and all of his wins were (I would have given it to him for Empire, and potentially Superman). However, a win this year would be totally undeserved-Memoirs wasn't nearly as impressive as Santaolalla. I can't say I wouldn't have nominated many of those 45 (though not all of them).

Oh, and for the record, I often complain about Meryl only having two trophies-number three is WAY overdue.

Glenn Dunks said...

While I won't begrudge any of his wins and even a lot of him nominations, it is beyond crazy that some people (to quote Nat, "angelo badalamenti... and especially Alexandre Desplat") haven't been nominated once.

The thought that the academy is going to put Williams' Memoirs score on the same level as Star Wars, ET, Jaws, Fiddler on the Roof and Schindler's List is sort of as rediculous as it is scary. Specially considering his Munich score is the better of the two (it's in my top of the 5)

Anonymous said...

Forgive my sitting-on-the-fence, but I can see both sides. I'm irked that he does get nominated so frequently for "blah" work (I'd contend that his work on Ep III was infinitely more impressive than his work on Memoirs, and particularly Munich).

Yet in disagreement that Raiders should have beaten Chariots (they're both iconic, but I'd give the edge to Chariots for its use in the context of the film itself).

But I also feel the pain of Williams fans who have to watch loss after loss. Us Meryl Streep fans (and it turns out we are in large numbers at this site) can understand. I can also see Judi Dench going in the same taken-for-granted nomination/loss direction, and as a fan that irks.


adam k. said...

Does it really irk when they've already won, though? Is that worse than not being nominated at all.

I concede that yes, Meryl's 3rd IS overdue, and I myself am getting annoyed to see her lose, but she's a special case. She is THE actress of our time, and Swank has more best actress oscars than she does. She will win again on #14... 10 losses in a row = too many. People will get that.

As for Williams... I mean, loss after loss getting annoying? He has after all won 5 times. Has any other composer won that many? I'm thinking no. So he's already won more than anyone, and been nominated FAR more than anyone. How then could he possibly then be underrewarded? Seriously. I personally think these Memoirs wins are mainly because it's been over 10 years now since he's won an oscar. That's longer than he generally goes without one. Also, having Yo Yo Ma play your score doesn't hurt. But I think Gustavo will win.

Pedro said...

From the Academy's database on Music Score (John Willimas is not the most nominated nor he is the one with more wins):

Statistics are valid through the 2004 (77th) Academy Awards, presented on February 27, 2005. [document last updated 4/15/05]


MOST NOMINATIONS ([#] indicates number of awards)
41 Alfred Newman [9]
38 John Williams [5]
20 Max Steiner [2]
19 Victor Young [1]
17 Jerry Goldsmith [1]
17 Ray Heindorf [3]
17 Morris Stoloff [3]
16 Miklos Rozsa [3]
14 Alex North [0]
14 Dimitri Tiomkin [3]

MOST AWARDS ([#] indicates number of nominations)
9 Alfred Newman [41]
5 John Williams [37]
4 John Barry [6]
4 Johnny Green [12]
4 Alan Menken [5]
4 André Previn [11]
3 Saul Chaplin [5]
3 Ken Darby [6]
3 Adolph Deutsch [5]
3 Roger Edens [6]
3 Ray Heindorf [17]
3 Maurice Jarre [8]
3 Miklos Rozsa [16]
3 Morris Stoloff [17]
3 Dimitri Tiomkin [14]

Return to Statistics Menu

Anonymous said...

Marcus Paul wrote:

"John Williams is, inarguably, one of the greatest composers alive today, and certainly the greatest musical craftsman in the world of film. One might aesthetically prefer the contributions of others, but that does not diminish Williams' achievements."

I found Paul's claims to be as bombastic as Mr. Williams' music. Williams is indeed a proficient musical craftsman, but aesthetically I find his work lacks subtlety, nuance, interest. That severely diminishes MY evaluation of his achievement.

Anonymous said...

As far as I'm concerned, the composer's job is to help the film, not exist as some kind of stand-alone composition. As such, the fact that Bernard Herrmann wasn't nominated for Psycho or Vertigo, Ennio Morricone wasn't nominated for Once upon a Time in America, David Manfield wasn't nominated for Heaven's Gate (great score for a lousy film), Philip Glass wasn't nominated for Mishima, are real black eyes on the Musicians' branch of the Academy. They really do seem like graybeards when they give those automatic nods to Williams. It's kind of like Alan and Marilyn Bergman getting so many, back in the day, for best song.

Anonymous said...

While we can argue about John William's 45 nominations, I'm more curious to see how many you (everyone here) thinks are undeserved? And who would you replace them with? Here are some of mine, more recent ones.

2005: Memoirs of a Geisha for Syriana of Howl's Moving Castle
2002: Catch Me If You Can for Talk to Her or The 25th Hour
2001: Harry Potter for Gosford Park or Mulholland Drive
2000: The Patriot for Requiem for a Dream
1999: Angela's Ashes for The Straight Story (the biggest snub ever)
1996: Sleepers for Angels and Insects

Anonymous said...

>>>Memoirs of a Geisha for Syriana of Howl's Moving Castle

I meant or, not of.

adam k. said...

OK, so I'm wrong, there is someone with more noms than Williams, and more wins. But you bet Williams will pass him eventually... at least in noms. Just give him 5 or 6 more years and he's there.

Oh man, 2001 was the worst year ever as far as score snubs were concerned. No Waking Life, no Gosford Park, no Mulholland (!), no Amelie even with its 5 nominations... and of course no Moulin Rouge since the score wasn't original enough. BUT two Willaims scores made it. Ugh.

John T said...

Personally, I loved both of Williams's scores in 2001, and would have nominated him for both.